Bernie or Biden?

Both can stand up better than any other candidate against Trump. So on that count, I’m not worried.

I’d gladly go for Bernie but I’m afraid that he might not be able to stand up to the loony-tunes SJWs he tends to surround himself with. It’s not even about the election. It’s about what happens after. I would be very happy to see a “workers rights, the open borders are a Koch brothers idea” Sanders presidency. But the idea of loonies coming to power and ruling through Bernie is intolerable.

This is very similar to what happened to Trump. All his anti-neoliberal ideas were thwarted completely by the fanatical neoliberals like Ivanka, Kushner and the rest of this crowd. They are young and rich, so how can they be anything else?

Biden doesn’t seem to be surrounded by the same kind of crazies that swarm around Bernie. But he’s such an unexciting candidate. Plus, what is the likelihood that he won’t be the same kind of an eager neoliberal as Obama?

The choice is ultimately between economic and ideological neoliberalism. And it’s not much of a choice because they are two sides of the same coin. One ultimately always leads to the other.

We are choosing between shades of neoliberalism on our side, folks. And of course both these oldsters (and I say this very affectionately because people over 75 are my favorite group after toddlers) are miles better than happy-clappy neoliberal fanatics like Buttigieg. He’s young and hasn’t known anything but neoliberalism, so our only chance for anything even remotely anti-neoliberal is a Methuselah. Nobody else is even capable of understanding what anti-neoliberalism is. There is zero difference between voting for Buttigieg and voting for Ivanka.

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20 thoughts on “Bernie or Biden?”

  1. As someone who will officially enter the “over 75” demographic later today, I am honored to be entering into your second favorite population group. I agree that toddlers are the best!

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    1. Oh goodness, happy birthday!

      In the past, people have attached nefarious motives to my love for older people, especially older men. But I was raised by my great-grandfather when he was this age and I adored him. So this is the reason why I’m so comfortable with older gentlemen.

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  2. All his anti-neoliberal ideas were thwarted completely by the fanatical neoliberals like Ivanka, Kushner and the rest of this crowd

    It’s hilarious you think he has anti-neoliberal ideas. Or ideas. Or that any of that crowd “thwarted” him with neoliberalism.

    Plus, what is the likelihood that he[Biden] won’t be the same kind of an eager neoliberal as Obama?
    Dude voted for the bankruptcy bill

    Bernie is a throwback and honestly the “wait, things didn’t used to be an unending treadmill of consumer debt” was a revelation for a lot of younger voters.

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    1. I do think he sincerely wanted the wall. And sincerely wanted a stop to illegal immigration. You don’t? I also think the tariffs and the renegotiation of NAFTA were what he honestly wanted. I’m not a mind reader but I thought this was sincere.

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      1. No. I really don’t. Otherwise why would he have hired illegal immigrants in his businesses if he was so fucking sincere? Or legal immigrants on guest worker visas for his Florida properties when locals are readily available. I live in Florida, it’s a falsity to state you can’t get seasonal workers for resorts. There’s nothing more neoliberal than demonizing the fuck out of immigrants and then turning around for their cheap, easily exploitable labor. Also, he was the only presidential candidate who didn’t use a union shop for his merchandise. You think neoliberals love unions? He wasn’t even interested in that pathetic sop to workers. Or, you know, what about the fact he kept throwing noncompetes at volunteers? Volunteers, people who work for free. So-anti-neoliberal there.

        And please don’t tell me he or his family divested himself from his businesses. That’s farcical prima facie nonsense.

        Also, he would’ve gotten the renegotiation of NAFTA through at least one house of Congress by now if he really wanted that. Why the hell are unions against this USMCA if it’s so great? “I want a trade war with China/whoops my children keep applying for Chinese patents and trademarks.” Please.

        He hates identity politics. Right, that’s why he snuggles up to white supremacists and they adore him.

        As for speech codes? Anti-neoliberalism has to be more than “I think South Park is right about some things”, otherwise the term is just meaningless garbage.

        I believe Trump sincerely wants the wall because he thinks he can get kickbacks to his businesses or the businesses of his donors. The wall and the camps would be great for the private prison industry. Profits are up, by the way. Prison is that great exception to the 13th Amendment where you can legally pay people zero dollars to do work. They can’t leave, they can’t protest their shitty working conditions, profit!

        I also believe he is very sincere and heartfelt in his racism.

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        1. Of course, as I said, nobody is a mind-reader, so we can try to guess if he’s sincere or not about this. I honestly have no idea which version is true. Maybe yours is. It’s quite likely.

          Here’s the question, though. If even somebody who is possibly completely insincere and is using limply anti-neoliberal rhetoric to advance very neoliberal ends (as you suggest) provokes such over-the-top yelping and howling, what would happen to anybody who’d run on a sincerely anti-neoliberal platform?

          Maybe this is why nobody does.

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          1. Of course, as I said, nobody is a mind-reader, so we can try to guess if he’s sincere or not about this.
            I’m just going by… what he does and what he’s most consistent on? We’re talking about someone who lies as he breathes.

            You don’t think Bernie ran on a sincerely anti-neoliberal platform? I think Bernie maybe isn’t as hated, even now.

            Also what makes you think the anti-neoliberal rhetoric is what freaks everyone out about Trump?

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            1. Bernie did say “open borders are a Koch brothers idea.” And for that he was bullied until he walked it back. Bit now he did walk in the good direction again. So yes, he has one good statement in his corner. Let’s see how long he’s allowed to stick to it.

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  3. It’s funny how pundits use the fact that people who have Biden as their first choice tend to have Bernie as their second and vice versa as proof that “the average voter isn’t ideological.” I’m incredibly ideological, I just view ideology through a different lens than they do, and so does the average voter. Of course, a lot of the reason they are the two most popular candidates is simply that they’re the two most well known, and once the primary debates start who knows how things will shake out.

    Right now I’m irritated with Bernie and therefore more inclined to go with Biden. But I think ultimately I’ll probably take a gamble at improvement over a guaranteed return to the “Obama’s second term” status quo (although Bernie could convince he’d be the worse choice, I’m going to be watching his campaign closely.) Tbh, we may be better off with a second Trump term, although I’ll never vote for him; it would mean we can elect more Democratic senators in 2022, and then if we elect a Dem in 2024 they’ll actually be able to accomplish something instead of being blocked at every turn by an obstinate GOP controlled Senate.

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    1. But I think ultimately I’ll probably take a gamble at improvement over a guaranteed return to the “Obama’s second term” status quo
      1. “Obama’s second term status quo” SUCKED, so I’m with you on that.

      Tbh, we may be better off with a second Trump term, although I’ll never vote for him; it would mean we can elect more Democratic senators in 2022, and then if we elect a Dem in 2024 they’ll actually be able to accomplish something instead of being blocked at every turn by an obstinate GOP controlled Senate.

      A second Republican term just means there’s going to be no real Democratic party. Senate terms are 6 years so the 2020 senators will be hanging around until 2026 at best; the Republican senators who won the 2018 elections are hanging around until 2024. Plus you’re forgetting about all the extra time the dude will have to pack the federal judiciary and possibly appoint more Supreme Court justices with an average age of 12. Imagine the fun of having all those laws passed by your fantasy Democratic congress declared unconstitutional over and over again.

      I guess I’m phone banking for whomever runs in Georgia and Doug Jones. :/

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      1. I’m also concerned about electing Dem governors (care more about that than the Senate, actually), and a second blue midterm would help with that. Also, two years with a Dem Senate and president (which would be the hoped for scenario here) would actually be pretty great. But the problems you note are real. There’s no great option here.

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        1. “Father Gagged, Found Guilty Of ‘Family Violence’ For Calling His Trans Daughter A ‘She'”

          It’s ironic that the U.S. Constitution was based on the Founding Fathers’ concept of English common law, but freedom of speech is now basically dead in the U.K. — and in much of Europe.

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          1. It’s completely dead.

            And see, it doesn’t occur to most people that this story is a manifestation of neoliberalism. It has an economic dimension with children being fed to the pharmaceutical industry over the objection of parents. And it has an ideological dimension because the goal is to free human beings from nature, from the dictates of physiology. Nature is being ravaged for profit. There’s nothing more neoliberal than this. But who’s speaking out against this on the progressive side? Obviously, nobody. This is why I keep saying that today’s progressivism has fully embraced neoliberalism.

            I don’t know how to explain this any more clearly.

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  4. Hah, there’s NO WAY Bernie Sanders is going to win a general election — not while he doubles down on giving terrorists the right to vote* and actually wags his finger at black audiences when they boo him!

    Also, if Bernie gets the nomination, Starbucks billionaire Howard Schultz is certain to run as a third-party “moderate alternative to Trump,” and most pundits think he’ll cost Democrats five votes for every lost Republican vote.

    Biden would be much more of a threat to Trump, but I don’t think he’s going to get the nomination. He’s off to a terrible start, anyway.

    BTW, did you notice that even though Melissa McEwan viscerally hates Bernie, she actually agrees with him on letting felons vote? 🙂

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    1. Biden just got “enthusiastically endorsed” by Michael Avanetti — so maybe now he’ll win the nomination after all.

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