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Linguistic and Cultural Confusion

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Clarissa

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I was discussing the syllabus with the students and discovered an interesting cultural / linguistic reality. The syllabus was prepared by my colleague who will teach most of the course after I go on maternity leave. A propos lab activities the syllabus says, “Workbook chapters are due on the designated dates no later than midnight.”

So the question is: if the designated date is September 3, when does the assignment have to be handed in? On September 2 before 11:59 pm or on September 3 before 11:59 pm?

I’m asking because I just discovered that the answer is different for me and my colleague. This is not a trivial question because a riot almost broke out in class today over this.

21 responses to “Linguistic and Cultural Confusion”

  1. Evelina Anville Avatar
    Evelina Anville

    That is confusing. I would say it’s by 11:59 on the day of the 3rd….which also gives them 1 minute on the 4th to submit.

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    1. bloggerclarissa Avatar
      bloggerclarissa

      Ha! That’s what I thought. But it turns out my colleague meant the 2nd.

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      1. cliff arroyo Avatar
        cliff arroyo

        Where is the colleague from and what is their logic?

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        1. bloggerclarissa Avatar
          bloggerclarissa

          It is a Hispanic colleague, and I’m not sure I get the logic either. Apparently, midnight means “the time right before the specified date begins” for the colleague.

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    2. cliff arroyo Avatar
      cliff arroyo

      I agree, I would interpret it as 23.59 on September 3.

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      1. Shakti Avatar
        Shakti

        It’s confusing… because I interpreted midnight as 12:00 am, and 12:00 am is the beginning of a new day so saying “no later than midnight on September 3rd” means “the professor will check the email no later than midnight before going to bed.” However, I almost never think of midnight as the beginning of the next day because I’m often still awake and I suspect many undergraduates are like that.

        Honestly it’s better to move up the stated dates a day, (from September 3rd to September 2) and state that any submissions need to be timestamped September 2nd 11:59:59 pm or:23;59:59 at the latest. Then there’s no ambiguity.

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  2. Jonathan Mayhew Avatar
    Jonathan Mayhew

    That’s why my due date always specifies 23:59! 12:00 midnight is the following date. So it would be Sept. 2? I don’t know why you’re saying “before” 23:59; it could be at 23:59 as long as the midnight hadn’t turned over. Or 00.00 exactly. You say “no later than” which means it can be “as late as.”

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    1. Jonathan Mayhew Avatar
      Jonathan Mayhew

      If you wanted to specify Sept 2 that would be a very dumb way to do it, though, so I’m assuming you meant Sept 3. It also implies the night getting later, when the due date is the whole day before that.

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      1. bloggerclarissa Avatar
        bloggerclarissa

        I thought it was September 3 but it turns out the colleague meant September 2nd.

        I used this situation to illustrate to the students the difficulties of understanding others within a shared language, let alone when 2 languages are involved.

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    2. bloggerclarissa Avatar
      bloggerclarissa

      The syllabus says “midnight” but that is confusing because it can be the midnight before the day begins or before the day ends.

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  3. el Avatar
    el

    On September 3 before 11:59 pm.

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    1. Jonathan Mayhew Avatar
      Jonathan Mayhew

      Why “before” 11:59? It says “no later than…” 11:59 is not later midnight? So you’re saying the real deadline is 11:58?

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      1. el Avatar
        el

        No, the latest is 11:59 or 12:00 (should be too OK, imo). But not 12:01, if professor wants to be super strict.

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  4. el Avatar
    el

    // I thought it was September 3 but it turns out the colleague meant September 2nd.

    The colleague was mistaken. I had many deadlines during studies and it would always mean 3rd.

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  5. David Bellamy Avatar
    David Bellamy

    It cannot possibly mean before 23:59. There would still be a minute left in the day before midnight. I agree with your interpretation, Clarissa, except that, say, submitting at 23:59:59 on the third of September would be within the rules as I see it.

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  6. sheddingkhawatir Avatar
    sheddingkhawatir

    I’m not sure it’s a language and culture thing–I recently changed everything to due by 11:59 pm due to confusion over this issue between my students and me (all American).

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  7. FD Avatar
    FD

    I’d interpret that as 11.59 pm on Sept 3rd.

    All our deadlines are within the faculty reception hours as that is where the paper copy of assignments are time stamped and handed in. Before 4pm is a lot less ambiguous.

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    1. bloggerclarissa Avatar
      bloggerclarissa

      I feel very normal now that I discovered that everybody has the same interpretation of this date as I do.

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  8. Avatar
    Anonymous

    It says ‘on the 3rd’ so you would turn it in sometime during that day. Once that day runs out (midnight) the assignment is late.
    He might’ve meant the other date, but you should clarify for the students!!!!

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  9. cliff arroyo Avatar
    cliff arroyo

    Trigger warning: stereotypes

    “It is a Hispanic colleague, and I’m not sure I get the logic either.”

    IME Hispanics in (but not from) the US react to the idea of deadlines, appointment times etc in one of two ways (without a whole lot inbetween)

    1. As if they’d never left home (la hora latina rules!)

    2. Internalize NAmerican rules and become even more fanatic about being on time (people meeting deadlines) than your average German.

    I wonder which your collleague is?

    For myself, in the wilds of central europe where people try to be really punctual but are really bad at the whole ‘deadline’ concept, I’m liable to give a deadline of “23.59 Tuesday August 20” but I don’t necessary stay up checking email that late (and if it arrives before noon the next day then I’m generally cool with it (and email isn’t always instantaneous).

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    1. bloggerclarissa Avatar
      bloggerclarissa

      “Internalize NAmerican rules and become even more fanatic about being on time (people meeting deadlines) than your average German.”

      – Maybe that is what is happening here. All of the English speakers on the blog and in the classroom gave my interpretation to the concept of “before midnight.”

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