He’s completely wrong.
It’s also a waste of time to ask primitive questions like this one but at least it doesn’t mention “rights”, so thank God for small mercies.
28 responses to “Q&A About Opinions”
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Ukraine joining Nato started the war. Duh.
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The prohibition on joining the NATO was in Ukraine’s constitution. Why there is a need to prattle uninformedly is a mystery.
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You’re absolutely right that Ukraine had a non-alignment clause in its constitution, which prohibited joining military alliances like NATO, at least up until 2019. This clause was a reflection of the delicate balancing act Ukraine had to manage between its sovereignty, relationship with Russia, and aspirations to move closer to the West.
However, in 2019, Ukraine’s parliament passed a constitutional amendment that removed that non-alignment provision, signaling a shift toward NATO membership. This decision was a result of growing public support for closer ties with NATO, especially after Russia’s annexation of Crimea in 2014 and its ongoing involvement in the conflict in eastern Ukraine.
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“NATO… NATO… NATO”
Muh Dude…. have you ever heard of of “cold reading”???
russia: We invaded Ukraine for (a lot of word salad, mostly about Kievan Rus and bad Soviet boundaries and ‘Banderites’ and empire)
west-hating westerners: You did it because of NATO! Didn’t you??!?! Plllleeease tell me you did it because of NATO. It has to be because of NATO!!!
russia: (thinks a moment) yeah…. because of NATO!
Read and learn: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cold_reading
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Nato established by Truman! LOL Post WWII. Pelosi and Biden favored the Ukraine joining Nato. Then through election fraud Trump lost the 2020 elections!
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Cliff, get off your soap-box. Both Napoleon and Hitler invaded Russia through the flat plains of the Ukraine. Wake up and smell the coffee. The Cuban missile crises during the Kennedy Administration, the US would not permit Soviet nukes in Cuba! Duh.
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The threat of the Ukraine joining Nato started the war. Duh.
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The threat of Israeli attack started the events of October 7, 2023. Duh.
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This same response equally applies to the Japanese surprise attack on Dec 7th 1941. Duh.
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“threat of the Ukraine joining Nato started the war”
Since you seem to need it, here is a thread from an Austrian journalist who specializes in dismantling russian disinformation…. you can thank me later.
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I respond with the opening quote: “I start with this: No! Putin does not want peace, he started the war, twice!” Quite correct, but when did Putin start the war? Under Trump or Biden? Key question that requires deep consideration. Why? B/c Trump opposed the Ukraine joining Nato while the Handlers of Biden, Pelosi and Obama favored Nato expansion to include Ukraine in that anti-Russian military Western European alliance!
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Nu Cliff cat got your tongue?
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“Cliff cat got your tongue?”
No. I’m just waiting for you to provide examples of russians expressing concern about NATO before Feb 24, 2022… even Karlin (fsb tool and putin-stan at the time) said it was irrelevant (at least he mentioned it).
You’ve got a mental model where only the US has agency and other countries are marionettes dancing at the end of US held strings.
I’m willing to engage with good faith arguments (no matter how wrong I think they are) but I’m not going to waste my time trying digging a dry well.
Here’s something to think about. I eagerly await your explanation for why NATO made russians hate Israel…..
https://cepa.org/article/only-good-news-today-russias-propagandists-delight-as-israelis-die/
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I brought 3 examples Napoleon and Hitler’s invasion of Russia through the planes of the Ukraine and the Cuban missile crisis.
Cliff do you seriously entertain that the US would permit a Soviet Army stationed on the Mexico Texas border? Why after two major invasions through the plains of the Ukraine do you obtusely assume that Russians view the Ukraine as just some other nation-state?
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“I brought 3 examples”
I asked for russian or Ukrainian analysts who claimed that fears of NATO “expansion” were the reason for the russian invasion of Ukraine (either before the 2022 invasion or within the first six months or so).
You brought 0 examples.
The US is (technically …. was) a military and economic and cultural superpower. russia is third rate wannabe with an economy (based on kleptocracy) smaller than countries with far less than half its population. It could be an economic and probably cultural superpower but it has other priorities… like invading neighbors under trumped up phony reasoning.
Not equivalent.
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There are two groups of people equally impossible to have a discussion with: SSRI addicts and NATO expansion whisperers. They get extremely emotional and end up accusing one of wanting to murder them by disrespecting their pet theories.
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2019 Ukraine amended their Constitution permitting it to join Nato. Pelosi’s first impeachment of President Trump based upon Trump’s refusal to permit Ukraine join Nato. Biden wanted the Ukraine to join Nato. Hence Putin invaded before it could.
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“2019 Ukraine amended their Constitution”
Five years _after_ russia invaded and the west did jack shit. So russia did not in fact invade in order to prevent anything NATO related.
And it’s natural they were looking for some kind of security guarantee that neither Obama or Merkel felt like giving.
Maybe NATO makes you feel safe and comfy… but do catch up.
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Trump is getting them baby corpses in return for hundreds of murderers of new babies, so they are happy.
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In short, while Biden and other Western leaders have supported Ukraine’s integration with NATO in the long run, they’ve been cautious about making an immediate push for membership due to the risk of inflaming tensions with Russia and because of NATO’s internal dynamics. It’s a fine line between showing support for Ukraine and preventing a broader conflict with Russia.
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Putin invaded in 2014.
And if Biden wanted Ukraine to join the NATO, why did he do and say the exact opposite?
No need to answer, I understand that this is at the level of personal psychology with you and I’m not qualified to help with that.
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NATO is a collective defense organization, meaning all current members must agree on any new member joining. Some European NATO members were more cautious about extending membership to Ukraine, as they feared it might lead to direct military confrontation with Russia, so Biden’s position was partly shaped by the wider alliance’s hesitations. In short, while Biden and other Western leaders have supported Ukraine’s integration with NATO in the long run, they’ve been cautious about making an immediate push for membership due to the risk of inflaming tensions with Russia and because of NATO’s internal dynamics. It’s a fine line between showing support for Ukraine and preventing a broader conflict with Russia.
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2014 under the clown Bozo the nigger in the White House’s watch. Biden the VP, he did not call the shots. Honestly do not understand your personal psychology temper tantrum remark.
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Russia paid a heavy loss with the fall of Assad! It lost its port in Syria. Propaganda good before the shooting starts. But once ‘game on’, propaganda amounts to empty shit.
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“Russia paid a heavy loss with the fall of Assad!”
And russian participation in the Syrian civil war was a major factor creating the ‘refugee’ problem that has had catastrophic social and economic effects in Europe. But Napoleon something Bismarck mumble mumble Angola…..
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No doubt about that, when my daughter visited Turkey 2 year past some 5 million Syrian refugees in Turkey. The Russian Army first employed the “scorched earth” tactic against Napoleon and later applied the same tactic against Hitlers’ Nazis.
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“they’ve been cautious about …. inflaming tensions with Russia”
Which is an incredibly stupid policy. Stand up to russia and cross their red lines and they back off. Show good will and they take it as weakness and escalate.
Finland joined NATO and not a peep from russia.
russia is _sooooo_ terrified of NATO that they took all their troops away from NATO borders to send them to Ukraine to die.
NATO is not some all powerful tool for baiting russia.
Look back at my post about cold reading and read it a few times.
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A conservative literary critic and college professor
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