Sign up for a free recipe e-book →

Clarissa's Blog

Debating the Holocaust

Published by

Clarissa

on

My analyst told me that his analyst had a client in the 1950s who tried to conceal his past for a few sessions. Then he finally confessed that he had been a guard at Treblinka. After this, there was nothing left to discuss in the sessions because there is no dialogue possible about this. What is there to discuss? So the analyst and the patient sat in silence for the next several sessions. The analyst said it cost him at least a decade of his own life to keep sitting in the same room with this animal. But he felt he had to do it to give the former guard an opportunity to face in silence the horror that he was and that he had done.

Human beings do not debate the Holocaust. And those who think there is room for discussion here should sit in silence and face the monster inside.

47 responses to “Debating the Holocaust”

  1. David Gendron Avatar
    David Gendron

    At least, you’re not like those fucktards in France with the Gayssot’s Law.

    Like

    Reply
  2. David Gendron Avatar
    David Gendron

    And in fact, Holocaust was not even debated in Nuremberg.

    Like

    Reply
    1. Tim Avatar
      Tim

      What?

      Like

      Reply
      1. David Gendron Avatar
        David Gendron

        Exactly, at Nuremberg, the Holocaust was considered as a fact, not a debate.

        Like

        Reply
    2. Tim Avatar
      Tim

      Oooooh okay. I thought you meant that the Holocaust was not a subject of the Nuremberg Trials und you meant that its occurence was deemed not debatable/debated.

      Like

      Reply
      1. David Gendron Avatar
        David Gendron

        Exactly, this was not debated because the capitalo-bolchevist winners had not interest in debating it.

        Like

        Reply
      2. David Gendron Avatar
        David Gendron

        Exactly, this was not debated because the capitalo-bolchevist winners had no interest in debating it.

        Like

        Reply
        1. bloggerclarissa Avatar
          bloggerclarissa

          No normal person sees an issue for debate here. What’s wrong with you?

          Like

          Reply
      3. David Gendron Avatar
        David Gendron

        So the main purpose of a lawsuit should not be debated?

        Like

        Reply
        1. bloggerclarissa Avatar
          bloggerclarissa

          Are you not feeling well? Are you sick, maybe? Because I don’t know how to explain what is happening to you these days, David.

          Like

          Reply
      4. David Gendron Avatar
        David Gendron

        So, normal persons suck.

        Like

        Reply
      5. David Gendron Avatar
        David Gendron

        Corrected: So the main purpose of a lawsuit should not be debated in this very lawsuit?

        Like

        Reply
        1. bloggerclarissa Avatar
          bloggerclarissa

          I think you should go sleep it off. Hopefully, you will feel better in the morning.

          Like

          Reply
      6. David Gendron Avatar
        David Gendron

        In fact, I was mentally sick way before that. Now, I’m feeling better even though I’m not sure if I’ll continue my Ph. D.

        Like

        Reply
        1. bloggerclarissa Avatar
          bloggerclarissa

          I’m sorry you are not feeling well! Are you seeing a doctor for this?

          Like

          Reply
      7. David Gendron Avatar
        David Gendron

        Yes, I saw a doctor, I take Zoloft, I see regularly a psychologist, I change many things in my life (not about the subject of this post 😉 ) and I’ll see a career counselor.

        Like

        Reply
        1. bloggerclarissa Avatar
          bloggerclarissa

          That’s good! I hope you get better soon. And if you need to change your career or take time off from the PhD, that can be a good thing for you.

          Like

          Reply
      8. David Gendron Avatar
        David Gendron

        Thank you.

        Like

        Reply
      9. el Avatar
        el

        Clarissa, not everybody who wants to debate Holocaust is “ill.” Even Nazis were normal too, not aliens from outer space or mentally ill (all of them).

        Not surprised to see normal people being anti-semits and having any feeling only for their own suffering.

        Had David being interested in debating or whatever, instead of only spitting at people, I would advise him take an online course in Yad Vashem (“Hand and Name” in Hebrew):
        http://www.yadvashem.org/yv/en/education/courses/index.asp

        Look at this page, may be, it would be of interest to you. Israeli school teachers can take various courses (to raise their salary), and my mother took history ones, in addition to math ones.

        The course I referred to previously is:

        Online Course: The “Final Solution of the Jewish Problem”
        “At the Edge of the Abyss: The Holocaust of European Jewry”
        This course covers the steps in the establishment of the “Final Solution,” and its execution in various countries. Through personal testimonies, Nazi documentation, research, and photographs, we learn about the evolution of the “Final Solution”, the camp system, daily life in the camps, and more.

        My mother took it, so I also read its materials. Unfortunately, the most interesting to me courses weren’t in Hebrew (my mother hasn’t studied English): “Prewar Jewish Life” and “Germany 1918-1943.” Especially the second, may be it could explain how usual Germans embraced the toxic ideology.

        Btw, I am reading “Male fantasies” now and like his writing style and some of the ideas. If you look at any books I mentioned, would *love* to hear your opinion.

        Like

        Reply
        1. bloggerclarissa Avatar
          bloggerclarissa

          “Clarissa, not everybody who wants to debate Holocaust is “ill.””

          – Of course, but I want to give David the benefit of the doubt.

          ” Israeli school teachers can take various courses (to raise their salary), and my mother took history ones, in addition to math ones.”

          – This is a great idea. We need something like this, too.

          “Unfortunately, the most interesting to me courses weren’t in Hebrew (my mother hasn’t studied English): “Prewar Jewish Life” and “Germany 1918-1943.” ”

          – My closest friend at my department teaches courses like these. The now retired administrator wanted to refuse her tenure on the grounds that “We don’t need Jews teaching our students, many of whom are children of German immigrants, about German culture. This will be very inconvenient!”

          Like

          Reply
      10. el Avatar
        el

        // – My closest friend at my department teaches courses like these. The now retired administrator wanted to refuse her tenure on the grounds that “We don’t need Jews teaching our students, many of whom are children of German immigrants, about German culture. This will be very inconvenient!”

        As if children of German immigrants to US really know what German culture was / is like. In Israel, for example, children of Russian speaking immigrants most often have no real idea about their parents’ culture and don’t really know Russian, except 3 words at home: “Bring that,” “do you want tea?”, etc. From what I read about Chinese immigrants to US, children lose their parents’ culture there too.

        Btw, a case of Holocaust itself being used against Jews: “our American Germans may not like that.” Want to tell her and all not liking people go to hell, frankly. 😦

        Has she taught courses about Holocaust, German history in general or both?

        The Yad Vashem courses I read were worthwhile. Lots of information. Good courses, but I wouldn’t advise taking the ones focusing on the “Final Solution.” Too horrible. The two I mentioned seem easier to some extent, and I am sure – interesting.

        Like

        Reply
        1. bloggerclarissa Avatar
          bloggerclarissa

          She has a trademark course on the Holocaust and she specializes in German literature of the Weimar Republic.

          Our students don’t even know who Jews are, so this administrator was projecting onto them the anti-semitism they weren’t even capable of having.

          Like

          Reply
      11. el Avatar
        el

        // Our students don’t even know who Jews are

        German students probably do know.

        Wanted to ask, during your MA, have you studied 2nd language, except Spanish? Has it helped you significantly in your research as a professor?

        Like

        Reply
        1. bloggerclarissa Avatar
          bloggerclarissa

          We had to pass a “Translation exam” in another language and mine was French. I can read and translate very easily, so I passed it with flying colors. Of course, it’s very helpful to be able to read articles by French colleagues.

          These German students have German names but they have been living in the US for generations, so they are not that German. 🙂

          Like

          Reply
      12. David Gendron Avatar
        David Gendron

        I’m not an anti-semit

        Like

        Reply
      13. el Avatar
        el

        // Of course, it’s very helpful to be able to read articles by French colleagues.

        Do you ever read Russian colleagues?

        Like

        Reply
        1. bloggerclarissa Avatar
          bloggerclarissa

          “Do you ever read Russian colleagues?”

          – There aren’t any. 😦 Literary criticism in Russian-speaking is dead. I try reading a literary critic from Russia every now and then only to feel sad and shocked by the state of the field. This is not accidental because scholarship doesn’t exist in a vacuum. If you repress all scholarship in a field for decades, you can’t expect the field to be reborn any time soon. I don’t know if ever it will be rebuilt. 😦

          Like

          Reply
  3. el Avatar
    el

    Now read on Israeli news site and found in English:

    NEW YORK (CBSNewYork) — The NYPD is looking into a series of attacks on Jews in Brooklyn. At least one attack was caught on surveillance tape.
    …
    Behrman said he believes the assaults are part of a disturbing game by some African-American teens.

    “And they’re playing a game: ‘knockout.’ ‘Knock out the Jew,’ maybe. And they’re going around the neighborhood punching Jews,” Behrman said.

    He said that in the last two months there have been assaults and three incidents of graffiti, incidents the police have confirmed, Slattery reported.
    http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2013/11/12/brooklyn-rabbi-gang-of-teens-playing-disturbing-game-of-knock-out-the-jew/

    There is something sadly ironic in African American teens, themselves knowing about discrimination, attacking religious Jews.

    Like

    Reply
    1. titfortat Avatar
      titfortat

      There is something sadly ironic in African American teens, themselves knowing about discrimination, attacking religious Jews.(el)

      The bullied becoming bullies………..nothing new there. Interesting how this may even tie back to Israel….hmmm.

      Like

      Reply
      1. el Avatar
        el

        Are those African Americans and Brooklyn Jews in conflict over land, resources, etc? Bullying doesn’t seem a suitable term to describe Israel (or USA in its beginning).

        Like

        Reply
        1. bloggerclarissa Avatar
          bloggerclarissa

          So violence is justified when it’s done for economic reasons? That’s a dangerous argument.

          Like

          Reply
      2. titfortat Avatar
        titfortat

        When people gain some power(after being on the receiving end) and then use it in an aggressive way its bullying, regardless of what its over.

        Like

        Reply
      3. bloggerclarissa Avatar
        bloggerclarissa

        “The bullied becoming bullies………..nothing new there. Interesting how this may even tie back to Israel….hmmm.”

        – Of course. That’s why I keep talking about traumatized people.

        Like

        Reply
      4. titfortat Avatar
        titfortat

        Of course. That’s why I keep talking about traumatized people.(Clarissa)

        I know you do. Funny thing, much of the traumatized seem to affiliate themselves with some ethnicity………..and then……….bul

        Like

        Reply
        1. bloggerclarissa Avatar
          bloggerclarissa

          Groups are comforting, they absolve one of responsibility. And when membership in them doesn’t need to be earned, they are also very easy.

          Like

          Reply
      5. titfortat Avatar
        titfortat

        Im thinking there were many a Jew that wouldn’t have thought it easy when the Gestapo came.

        Like

        Reply
        1. bloggerclarissa Avatar
          bloggerclarissa

          Sadly, nobody wants to think about the price that people always end up being for these joys of collectivity.

          Like

          Reply
      6. titfortat Avatar
        titfortat

        Truest words Ive heard you utter.

        Like

        Reply
  4. el Avatar
    el

    One smart person recommended this book to me:

    Klaus Theweleit – “Male Fantasies”
    Here I found a review:
    http://www.shaviro.com/Blog/?p=280

    I think you will love it: very long book, Freudian analysis, study of the relations between misogyny and fascism, etc. If you read, please, review!

    Like

    Reply
  5. el Avatar
    el

    The last comment for now, just found this article and wanted to share:

    America’s angriest white men: Up close with racism, rage and Southern supremacy
    Up close with small-town white rage, with bitter, scary men who feel left behind by economic and cultural change
    http://www.salon.com/2013/11/17/americas_angriest_white_men_up_close_with_racism_rage_and_southern_supremacy/

    He tries to answer “Who are the white supremacists?” and writes about “THE CLASS ORIGINS OF RACIAL POLITICS”

    Like

    Reply
  6. musteryou Avatar
    musteryou

    Bataille says there is nothing really to say to some tragic events, like French soldiers returning from war all beat up. But laughter rubs it in that there is nothing to say. Then everything returns to silence.

    Like

    Reply
  7. musteryou Avatar
    musteryou

    https://www.youtube.com/my_videos?o=U

    Like

    Reply
  8. el Avatar
    el

    Also wanted to ask, wouldn’t your colleagues write in Spanish rather than French, when talking about Spanish lit? How does it work in academia? If the topic is English lit f.e., wouldn’t the article itself be in English, no matter where the author lives?

    Like

    Reply
    1. bloggerclarissa Avatar
      bloggerclarissa

      I publish both in English and Spanish. Soon, an article of mine will come out in French. Many people don’t dominate a language well enough to write scholarship in it, but they have useful things to say, so they write it in their own language. Plus national governments (except the US) support (financially) scholarship written in the language of the nation. Quebec, for instance, pours millions into getting people to publish in French on absolutely any topic. The US doesn’t need to do that for obvious reasons.

      Like

      Reply
      1. el Avatar
        el

        What about German, for example? Have you thought of studying the language? Interesting whether in German or in French articles are more numerous. How could you tell that before beginning to study French?

        Klaus Theweleit’s book I am reading is fascinating, but his other books in German haven’t been translated into English (except one another).

        Like

        Reply
        1. bloggerclarissa Avatar
          bloggerclarissa

          I began to study French when I was 11. That was way before I decided to get a PhD in Hispanic Studies. 🙂

          I also began to study German way before I started learning Spanish. My German was quite good but I never got into it. My sister was the one whose German was amazing.

          Now, of course, I have discovered that there is a lot of really good stuff in my discipline that’s in German. Sadly, i have forgotten most of my German by this time.

          Like

          Reply
  9. el Avatar
    el

    California School District Gives Students Absolutely Jaw-Dropping Assignment in Attempt to ‘Meet Common Core Standards’

    The Rialto school district in California is under fire over a stunning eighth-grade assignment that asked students to write an argumentative essay about the Holocaust and “whether or not you believe this was an actual event in history, or merely a political scheme created to influence public emotion and gain wealth.” […]

    The San Bernardino Sun first reported on the 18-page assignment that gives students three sources to use to write their essays. One of the sources reportedly alleges the gassings in concentration camps were a “hoax” and there is no evidence Jews actually died in gas chambers.

    The source, traced to a webpage on biblebelievers.org.au, states: “With all this money at stake for Israel, it is easy to comprehend why this Holocaust hoax is so secretly guarded. In whatever way you can, please help shatter this profitable myth. It is time we stop sacrificing America’s welfare for the sake of Israel and spend our hard-earned dollars on Americans.”
    http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2014/05/05/california-school-district-gives-students-jaw-dropping-holocaust-assignment-in-attempt-to-meet-common-core-standards/

    Like

    Reply

Leave a comment

A conservative literary critic and college professor

Recent posts