And the Not-so-nice

And now the not-so-nice side of American people has started to come out. A collective hounding of the police officer who said, “Do you think it’s worth towing the car over a dog?” has begun.

The officer didn’t kick the dog, didn’t harm it, didn’t do anything bad at all. He simply said something some people found insensitive. The capacity of Americans to persecute somebody for saying something they don’t like knows no bounds.

The dog has been rescued, everything is fine, why not just go home, feeling good about the situation? But no, people have got to make trouble for the officer who didn’t even do anything wrong.

The expectations of verbal perfection are way too high. I’m all for being careful with words but I detest this habit of collectively hounding a person for saying something mildly unfortunate.

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31 responses to “And the Not-so-nice”

Dreidel

June 18, 2016

Well, it’s nice to read a story about a cop rescuing a dog, instead of shooting down the family pet for wagging its tail at him — something that cops do with distressing regularity when they enter someone’s property and see a dog reacting to a stranger on its territory. (Somehow mail carriers encounter dogs everyday, and manage to do their duty without killing them.)

Being a retired doctor and military officer, I’ve always gotten along well with the police — never once got a speeding ticket despite my lead foot when my driving license said “physician,” or I was in uniform.

But cops have a distressing habits of killing family dogs with no justification and no consequences. When a cop shoots a human, he”s put on administrative leave until the matter is investigated. Same rule should apply to dogs.

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el

June 18, 2016

\ Somehow mail carriers encounter dogs everyday, and manage to do their duty without killing them.

“Royal Mail’s postmen and women deliver six days a week to more than 29 million addresses across the UK and dog attacks are a significant hazard with around eight postmen and women a day attacked across the UK. Over 2,960 postmen and women were attacked across the UK by dogs from April 2014 to April 2015 some leading to a permanent disabling injury.”

AND

Jill Coulson, the CWU’s area safety rep for South Cheshire, said the situation could now affect some deliveries. “We’ve got to the point now where we say, ‘if you’re in any doubt, do not deliver’. They are not to go and put themselves at risk and they’re to fetch the mail back,” said Jill.
http://www.crewechronicle.co.uk/news/crewe-south-cheshire-news/posties-bite-back-over-dog-7294684

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1. Dreidel
  
  June 18, 2016
  
  If a dog actually bites anyone on a person’s property, then the dog’s owner should be held fully liable legally. Back in the 1960s and 1970s, some U.S. postal carriers carried spray cans of the deterrent “Mace” to spray into the dog’s face. Refusing to deliver the mail is also an option, although today most American residential mailboxes are at curbside or a shared community box than on the front door.
  
  But most stories of cops-killing-dogs on the Internet tell of cops going to the wrong house, or simply crossing an innocent person’s yard, and shooting any medium-size dog that that comes up to them to take a sniff — certainly a hair-trigger, premature reaction.
  
  The only “happy-ending” story I’ve read recently occurred when a cop went to a house to serve a minor warrant, saw a small dog coming toward him, panicked and drew his gun, and proceeded to shoot himself in the foot. The dog came up to the wounded cop and licked his hand. Someone notified the local television channel, and the evening news showed the cop being taken away by ambulance while the dog was surrounded by 3-year-old neighbor children lovingly petting it while it nuzzled them.
  
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  1. Clarissa
    
    June 18, 2016
    
    Dogs are horrible. But nobody seems to hate dogs more than dog owner. I hate dogs but I’d never leave one in a car in the midst of a heat wave. One has really got to be a piece of work to do that.
    
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    1. Dreidel
      
      June 18, 2016
      
      Ah, Clarissa — dogs and cats are among the most noble of the world’s lower animals, giving love and comfort to the human race for centuries: Showing unfailing loyalty and unconditional love to their owners, never passing judgment, and often (even cats) rushing to their owner’s defense when the owner is attacked by another animal or even a human.
      
      In my younger days I was misguided enough to snicker at pets as “substitute people,” easy-to-control faux companions for those who couldn’t form real human friendships. But as I’ve gotten older and wiser, I’ve learned that pets aren’t a replacement for humans — they’re an adjunct to human companionship, similar to small children who give uncritical love and show absolute dependency, except that, unlike children, pets remain in that blessed state forever.
      
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      1. Clarissa
        
        June 18, 2016
        
        Cats I don’t mind because they don’t make loud and obnoxious noises and do seem capable of acting in somewhat predictable ways. Dogs, on the other hand, are the stupidest animals I’ve ever seen. There is this vicious little creature in the neighborhood I used to live that its owners tie to a pole by its neck. The stupid little thing is so devoid of any instinct that she strains at the leash for hours, wheezing and almost choking itself. For years this has been going on but the dog hasn’t been able to learn that it’s only hurting itself. As for the owners, it’s hard to determine whom they hate more, the animal or the neighbors who have to listen to the noise for years.
        
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        Stringer Bell
        
        June 18, 2016
        
        The ‘vicious little creature’ is the one who keeps the dog tied at all times.
        
        Dogs are smart and awesome! It’s the one species that we have specifically engineered to respond to our needs. Do you not know the kind of things guide dogs do?
        
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        Pen
        
        June 18, 2016
        
        “Cats I don’t mind because they don’t make loud and obnoxious noises and do seem capable of acting in somewhat predictable ways.”
        
        -This seems to be the reason most campsites don’t allow dogs. My parents once asked the campsite manager, “but what about cats?” He said it should be okay. So they brought the cat and put him in the tent while they went to get some groceries. When they came back he was yowling so loud they could hear him all the way across the campsite. My mom thinks they might have banned cats since then, as well. :p
        
        That dog in your neighborhood has been sorely neglected. A dog should never be left outside on a tie-out unsupervised for that long a time, for that exact reason. It’s very easy for a reactive dog to choke themselves on a tie-out like that. The tie-out probably isn’t long enough for it to get nearly enough exercise, either. A well-trained dog (and a tired dog) is a happy dog, in my experience, and a lot easier to be around. Everything I’ve read of your past experiences with dogs speaks more of irresponsible owners, not of the dogs. It’s never appropriate to let your dog jump all over people, or to let them off-leash unsupervised.
        
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        Clarissa
        
        June 18, 2016
        
        It always strikes me as curious that with all my hatred of dogs, I’m actually much kinder to them than people who claim to like them. Dogs are animals. They are not fluffy toys. The existence on a leash and constantly constrained is horrible for them. The so-called training is deeply traumatic. A “happy” dog is the one that makes everybody’s life hell because it lives its animal life freely. A convenient dog is one that is tortured to satisfy its owners’ need for a live toy.
        
        I have another neighbor who has 4 huge dogs. They are locked inside all day long. Whenever I pass the house, they throw themselves at the window and bark and howl horribly. I can’t even imagine how horrible it must be for such large creatures to be locked up inside all the time. But the owner is surely considered a huge dog lover by everybody.
        
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        Pen
        
        June 18, 2016
        
        How exactly is the training traumatic? When done properly, the dog is never beaten or starved. There are some successful positive reinforcement trainers who never even tell their dog “no.” A dog on a leash isn’t necessarily unhappy. And once recall is solid, off-leash adventures abound.
        
        I’ll take an example from someone who trains service dogs. They are socialized with humans from the time they are puppies. For the first year, everything is “100% fun, fun, fun.” If the dog stops enjoying the work they’re doing, or if they show signs of not enjoying the training, it stops. The dog is no longer a service candidate, dog in training, or service dog. It lives the rest of its life as a pet.
        
        Then there are the high-drive working dogs. They NEED to be trained and well-exercised. They seek praise from humans and are exceedingly enthusiastic. They want to do what you ask–otherwise they wouldn’t do it at all. Believe it or not, those dogs that make everybody’s life hell aren’t generally happy at all. They’re unsure of their place in their “pack,” or they just don’t know how to behave because they’ve been allowed to get away with absolutely everything. If they see themselves as the dominant life form of the household, it causes them to seek dominance over people and dogs outside of the household, as well. So then the dog isn’t properly socializing, and doesn’t really have a proper place with regards to outside “packs.”
        
        A good rule of thumb when training is to always set your dog up for success. If they fail at something, or if they frustrate you, don’t take it out on them–just approach it another way. I honestly don’t see how that is traumatic for them.
        
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        Clarissa
        
        June 18, 2016
        
        Pen, you are discussing animals with the words that can only be used to talk about humans. This weirds me out. I don’t see much difference between this and “my table is happy and seeks dominance because it’s properly socialized.”
        
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        Pen
        
        June 18, 2016
        
        But animals aren’t the same as furniture. You consider them property, and I have no issue with that. However, there is a distinction between furniture and a living, breathing, thinking animal. Humans aren’t the only animals that have thoughts. Though animals don’t think in words, their behaviors reveal aspects of those thoughts. Since they don’t think the same way we do, however, we need to find some way to communicate to and about animals. Humans think in human terms, and our discussions about animals and their behavior reflect that. I’d make the argument that as long as you have a clear idea of exactly what behaviors or actions you’re describing, this differs from anthropomophizing the animal. People who actually treat their pets as humans tend to have a poor grasp of animal behavior.
        
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        Clarissa
        
        June 18, 2016
        
        So do the chicken or the salmon many of us had for dinner tonight also have thoughts? 🙂
        
        Are you a vegan?
        
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        Pen
        
        June 18, 2016
        
        They do. They see and process the world in a particular way (related to their anatomy), and that is what defines their behavior. Even a fruit fly has thoughts, though they are not what you and I would recognize as such. And no, I’m not a vegan. :p Discussing animal behavior doesn’t make me suddenly lack the desire to eat meat. Though I do feel uncomfortable eating anything that has been prepared with eyes.
        
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        Pen
        
        June 18, 2016
        
        In response to Stringer Bell:
        
        Not only guide dogs–all service dogs! They’re absolutely amazing!
        
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        Clarissa
        
        June 18, 2016
        
        For every guide dog there is a million noisy, stinky, annoying creatures that make neighborhoods unlivable for pedestrians, older people, disabled people, pregnant women, small childen, etc.
        
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        Dreidel
        
        June 18, 2016
        
        You should consider filing a complaint against your dog-abusing neighbors on two grounds: the constant noise is a disturbance to the neighborhood, and their treatment of the dog constitutes cruelty to animals.
        
        Or threaten to “out” them to the St. Louis PETA chapter, whose members will probably show up with torches and pitchforks! 🙂
        
        Here in Arizona, dogs left outside on leashes don’t last very long. Either the extreme arid heat kills them, or they’re attacked by roaming swarms of killer bees.
        
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        Clarissa
        
        June 18, 2016
        
        A much greater disturbance is cerated by people who let their nasty creatures wander around without a leash. Those are real evildoers. I don’t care what they do with their property as long as said property doesn’t get in my way.
        
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Stringer Bell

June 18, 2016

Plus, you have to know by now that if Dreidel and I agree on something, that has to be the truest thing ever known to mankind. Like ‘water is wet’ level of correctness.

So, just take it from us: dogs and cats are super mega awesome!

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Buschmann

June 18, 2016

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Pen

June 18, 2016

“A much greater disturbance is cerated by people who let their nasty creatures wander around without a leash. Those are real evildoers. I don’t care what they do with their property as long as said property doesn’t get in my way.”

-It’s a huge issue if they’re letting them off-leash unsupervised. They can be reported for that. If the dog simply escaped, which happens, that’s another issue. There are also the responsible owners who, when walking off-leash, are still in complete control of the dog and won’t let them just wander off.

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Dreidel

June 18, 2016

You’re wasting your time trying to reason with a hardcore dog hater. (It’s like trying to reason with a hardcore Democrat.)

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1. Pen
  
  June 19, 2016
  
  “You’re wasting your time trying to reason with a hardcore dog hater. (It’s like trying to reason with a hardcore Democrat.)”
  
  -I’m enjoying it, though. I like discussing things like this. I disagree with Clarissa on so few things (especially so intensely). It’s nice to express my disagreement once in a while. I assume if she gets really annoyed with me she’ll say so.
  
  Eventually the discussion will end with the both of us still disagreeing, and everything will go back to normal. That doesn’t mean we can’t discuss it like rational people. I see so many people who refuse to discuss these things with people who disagree with them (or who can’t discuss without it turning into a huge issue), that arguing my point with Clarissa here reminds me that rationality still exists.
  
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  1. Clarissa
    
    June 19, 2016
    
    Unlike animals or plants, human beings are rational individuals and can engage in reasonable discussions. 🙂
    
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Clarissa

June 18, 2016

Any “control” of an animal is an illusion. It’s all in the owners’ heads. My friend is disabled. She was walking when a dog attacked and mangled her. The idiot owner kept repeating that the dog had never done it before. As if that was in any way relevant to anything. And the court did not even make the beast who had tasted human blood to be put down. After which the animal attacked a toddler.

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1. Pen
  
  June 18, 2016
  
  Again, I’d say this speaks more of the owner’s irresponsibility than of the dog. The dog may not have done it before–but it’s the owner’s fault that it happened in the first place. A reactive dog can be dangerous, and it’s the owner’s responsibility to work with the dog and keep a proper handle on it so that things like that don’t happen. A responsible owner should also know their dog well enough to recognize an aggressive or fear reaction and how to deal with it before it gets out of hand.
  
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  1. Clarissa
    
    June 18, 2016
    
    Guns don’t kill people. People kill people. 🙂
    
    Yes, a dangerous weapon is only dangerous because humans get distracted or make a mistake. But the presence of a weapon does make a situation more likely to turn violent.
    
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    1. Pen
      
      June 18, 2016
      
      The dog isn’t a weapon on its own merit, though. It’s not some inanimate object. It’s alive, it thinks, it responds to its environment. Is such an action acceptable? Absolutely not. That dog should have been evaluated by an experienced dog trainer to see what caused such an outburst and remediate the issue. Can all reactive dogs be rehabilitated? No. Are some dogs naturally more reactive than others? Yes. The way the dog is raised or treated by the owner, though, is what makes or breaks the behavior. The dog doesn’t train itself to attack. The owner is in charge of the dog, so the owner is liable for any damage the dog does.
      
      If I’m out walking my dogs, and someone else walks by, I pull all three of them off to the side. I keep firm control over all of them, even the largest. I do my best to keep the reactive dog from barking his head off. If the owner can’t control the dog, something is wrong with the owner, not the dog. If the dog is reactive, it should be on a leash and under constant supervision. Would my dogs bite? I think not, but I’ve never been in that situation before. And I never will, as long as I keep control over my dogs when out in public. It’s my responsibility. Not the dogs’. Accidents do happen. It’s the owner’s responsibility to make sure they don’t happen again.
      
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      1. Clarissa
        
        June 19, 2016
        
        Dogs are actually a lot less capable of responding to the environment than other animals. They have been bred and tinkered with so much over the centuries that even their natural animal instincts are damaged. It always stuns me how incapable they are of learning or retaining even the most basic information. Not even an instinct of self-preservation is there.
        
        As for attacking, that’s what animals do. They don’t need to be trained to attack. They need to be trained not to, and even that either works or not and is entirely unpredictable. And these accidents that do happen are hurt, mangled human beings who are paying for somebody else’s illusion that they understand the “thoughts” of an irrational beast.
        
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        Stringer Bell
        
        June 19, 2016
        
        No.
        
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        Pen
        
        June 19, 2016
        
        Sure, animals don’t need to be trained to attack. The behavior can be reinforced. However, there is always a reason for the attack. An animal doesn’t just attack out of nowhere for no reason at all. That reason has everything to do with response to the environment–which is what I meant by response. They aren’t necessarily trained not to attack, either–though I suppose our views on exactly what constitutes an attack probably differ quite a bit. An attack, to me, is violent, resulting in a clear injury to one or both parties. Dogs are very physical, but they’re not typically violent unless something is seriously wrong in their environment. A violent reaction to an immediate stimulus often ties back to a previous stimulus or reinforcement pattern.
        
        Dogs do learn and retain information. They’re pack animals, though–they don’t learn nearly as well on their own than they do with someone (usually a human or other dogs or animals) else around to provide consistency. If there’s no consistency in reinforcement, there’s no place for the behavior in the dog’s life.
        
        It’s not the thoughts themselves that need to be understood, though. It’s the behavior. There’s a reason behind every behavior that any animal exhibits, even if that reason isn’t clear. Which is why, when an animal suddenly becomes violent for no apparent reason, someone trained in that animal’s behavior should evaluate before such a decision is made.
        
        I am very sorry about your friend, and I can understand why they would seek to have the dog put down. The owner was extremely irresponsible, and I hope they were made to pay for the damage that was caused. I also know that you seem to have a history of running into irresponsible dog owners. Just know that not all of us are like that.
        
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