When people ask for advice on public online resources, they should expect a lot of unsolicited suggestions to pour in. Here is my contribution to answering the following question:
My 13 yr old son is addicted to porn. (In a nutshell). He consumes straight porn. I try to be very open about sexuality in the house with him and his brothers; he’s the middle one. However, basically, my fear is that he is seeing women be degraded and presented as a product for consumption. I know there are varying schools of thought surrounding porn and whether it can be empowering for participants, but that isn’t really relevant to whether it communicates to a young man that women are a product to be consumed by the heterosexual male gaze. I referred him to Scarleteen for sex questions, but that doesn’t seem sufficient.
First of all, how come this woman is so aware what kind of porn her son watches? How does she know that he watches it at all? If the boy thinks it is a good idea to inform his Mommy about such activities, then he is a miserable kid who is lagging behind his peers developmentally in an alarming way. Most people know by age 5 that masturbation is not an activity about which we need to render accounts to our parents. I can only imagine how many times his boundaries have been violated by his parents to make him believe he needs to inform them about his porn watching.
If the mother knows about this because she spies on her son, that’s tragic, too. I feel profound compassion for a teenager who can’t escape from Mommy’s gaze even while he is learning to explore his sexuality and discovering the pleasure his body can give him. Having a mother intrude upon this process in such a tactless way is incredibly traumatic.
Note also the mother’s belief that her son’s sexuality needs her approval. She cannot tolerate the idea that he might have any fantasies that do not conform with her political beliefs. All of her concern about women’s objectification sounds hollow when it is offered in the context of such a blatant and cruel objectification of a son by his mother. She needs to police his sexual fantasies and eradicate them if they don’t satisfy her.
And now my two pieces of unsolicited advice:
1. Instead of policing a teenager’s sex life, try to organize a sex life of your own. A kid who is going through puberty does not need to be a victim of his parents’ sexual hunger. As soon as questions about your son’s sexual fantasies start bothering you, go have sex with an adult. Or five adults. Or fifteen. repeat the exercise until these thoughts stop being obsessive and you become lucid enough to realize that his fantasies are none of your business. Just like your fantasies are none of his.
2. Remember that your son’s sexuality belongs only to him and that people whose boundaries are constantly violated by their parents find it very hard to figure out what enthusiastic consent even means. And it isn’t porn that should be blamed for this.
As for the fear that porn will mess up his attitude to women, you can relax. His attitude to women has already been formed by what he has observed in the relationship of his parents. Besides, with this kind of a pervasive, overbearing and disrespectful mother, the chances that he will not spend his life being victimized by controlling, bossy women who will walk all over his sexuality are quite slim.
Advice for everybody else: don’t read the comments to the linked post.
Want to know why? Here is comment #1 in the thread:
Personally, I would sit down and watch a porn video with him pointing out why certain aspects are BS.
Scary shit.
Clarissa's Blog 
Ya know, it’s funny – you and I have a very different take on this parent. When I read this, I thought “thank GOD there’s a parent out there who is allowing her child to explore his own sexuality in a safe environment, where he doesn’t feel he has to hide out under his bed in the dead of night to keep it completely under lock and key so that his parents don’t find out and try to teach him abstinence or some other insane thing”. I didn’t see any of the major red flags you raised in your discussion. His mother knows about his activities. So what? He lives at home, he’s 13 years old, for crying out loud! It’s still his mother’s job to help him to grow up into a responsible, respectful, decent human being. To me, that question reads as a mother who’s trying to figure out how to do that *without* crossing those boundaries and policing her son’s sex life. She’s not trying to stop him, she’s not trying to change what he watches. She’s not trying to get him to do anything differently. She’s trying to figure out how she, as his guide into adulthood, can help him be the best person he can be, in all aspects of his life, WITHOUT trying to change his personal life drastically. And quite frankly, I think that’s admirable.
Maybe that’s my opinion because I grew up with so many of my boundaries violated, that I hung on to every little thing I did as a complete, utter secret, to be hidden from my parents at all costs, but I think it’s a good environment, if a child can say to his mother “I watched a porn film and enjoyed it” and not be afraid of every one of their privileges being revoked and having their privacy completely violated even more.
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Would you really feel comfortable knowing that your father is aware of when, how much and what kind of pornography you have consumed and then discusses it at length with his male friends? Would you enjoy your father seeing himself as your guide into adult sexuality? Would you like it if he wanted to help you be the best person you can be sexually? Imagine that this is something a father wrote about his teenage daughter. Would you admire him?
“Maybe that’s my opinion because I grew up with so many of my boundaries violated, that I hung on to every little thing I did as a complete, utter secret, to be hidden from my parents at all costs, but I think it’s a good environment, if a child can say to his mother “I watched a porn film and enjoyed it” and not be afraid of every one of their privileges being revoked and having their privacy completely violated even more.”
– If at 13 he still doesn’t understand that this is none of his mother’s business, then when will he arrive at this understanding? Of course, it’s tragic when a child is terrified of being punished for what s/he is or does, but it is equally tragic when s/he still has no private space of hir own at 13. This is the age when you are already supposed to be at the second stage of separation from the parents, yet here even the first stage hasn’t even begun.
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Well, “discusses it at length with his male friends” – I don’t see evidence of this, do you? If my father had sent a similar email, anonymously, to a help-forum for advice, I honestly wouldn’t be offended. There’s no discussion (beyond “straight porn”) of what it is (and there’s no evidence that the parent knows exactly what it is).
“Guide into adult sexuality” – she referred him to an external source – she said that directly. But that’s not really what this is about – it’s about a mother expressing concern that her son might get the idea that women are objects not people. I think that’s adultHOOD not adult sexuality. The mother is plainly not asking for advice on how to make her son into a sex god. She sent him elsewhere for actual questions on sex – brothers and external websites – she knows what he does is his business not hers. She’s asking about how she can guide his views on women so he has less of a chance of growing up to be a complete asshole.
I don’t think this is that much a question on controlling her son’s consumption on porn, but on trying to make sure she has the right resources in place to help him be a good person.
Also, ironically, the only bit of sex education I got from either of my parents was from my dad, who told me in no uncertain terms one day when I was complaining to him about all the gross stuff we’d discussed in health class that day in school (STDs and other such things) and he said to me “You know, they tell you all this awful stuff in school about the horrible things that sex can do to you, but has anybody ever told you that sex is fun?” – to which I looked at him with huge eyes thinking “eww no” and said “no”. He responded with “well it is, and I hope that when you’re ready to try it one day, you’ll keep that in mind.” And that was the end of the conversation.
@Miriam (and Clarissa) – Yes, I agree – parents should stay out of their kids sex lives unless they’re endangering themselves or others. This parent is just trying to make sure that “endangering others” thing doesn’t happen. “An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure” after all.
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Haha, this post is great.
I do think that a brief discussion about porn–in general–would be a good addition to any “birds and bees” talk, because I think it’s good to point out to young teens that porn can be a great source of pleasure (and inspiration) but that it also represents people and sex unrealistically a lot of the time. I feel like everyone’s had partners who seem to expect them to perform sex like a porn star, and that’s really unfortunate.
But other than that? Parents should stay out of their teens’ sex lives as long as they’re not endangering themselves or others. And porn, by definition, doesn’t endanger yourself or anyone else.
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That’s exactly what I wanted to say. But in a really wordy way. 🙂
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HAHA, wait, who was wordy, you or me? If the latter, guilty as charged. My posts are all about 1000 words, so at least I don’t come over and leave them in your comments section!
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Me, of course. It’s a long-standing issue I have. I even answer the question of “how are you?” with a lecture. 🙂
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Could that be an Eastern European thing? I feel like it’s very American to just be like “good, you?” I mean, if someone just wants to hear you say “good,” why ask?!
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As an autistic, I tend to be very literal. If people ask about my state of being, they have got to be interested in the answer, right? I’m trying to stop being so literal but it doesn’t always work. 🙂
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I do that, too, and I am an American-born autistic person.
(That is, if I even know the answer. Most often, I have to stop and think for a long time before I can answer it.)
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//As an autistic, I tend to be very literal. If people ask about my state of being, they have got to be interested in the answer, right? I’m trying to stop being so literal but it doesn’t always work.
I am not autistic, but may be this will be helpful: unless it’s a close to you person, the expected answer is automatic, parrot – like:
– How are you?
– Good, thank you.
Like learners of English see in study books.
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That is grammatically incorrect — standard is “fine” or “well.” Good means virtuous, in a person, unless it modifies something — a good pornographer, for instance — which would in turn be the answer to a different question (what are you, for instance, not how).
Yes, I know it is pedantic to say this, but all of this has to stop somewhere. I once got a note from a Peruvian hotel assistant, practicing his English, saying “You gonna” in lieu of “Please” or “You should/you must.” He swore his textbook was written that way.
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I have to interject here. In colloquial English “I’m (doing) good” is the common answer to “How are you (doing)?,” even though grammatically an adverb (e.g. “well”) should be used instead of the adjective (“good”). I cannot remember the last time I heard an American say “I’m well” or even “I’m doing well” in response to the above question. Perhaps because saying that you are well means your health is OK, and that’s not really what you were asked, you were asked about things are generally in your life. Anyway, “I’m good” it may be grammatically incorrect, but it is the common form and I don’t think it’s misleading…
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In Australia, people say Hewyergoin? It doesn’t require an answer always.
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In Colombia, people say ¿Qué más?, the literal meaning of which is What else?
It was always very funny to get a phone call that started with an aggressive, “What else?”
“Nothing else since you are the one who’s calling,” I’d always say.
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Outside Walmart and other illiterate spaces, what I hear in US is “fine.” Colloquial, OK, but what amazes me is that “good” and also “you gonna” now appears as standard in ESL courses.
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Since I’m a very superlative person, how about, “Fantastic!” or “Phenomenal!” Or is that too annoying?
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It was the word “addicted” that caught my eye. Speaking as a male who was raised in the “sex was evil and lust is just as bad” environment, this post left me with a lot to think about. On the one hand, at least the parent is trying to be somewhat open-minded and allow that masturbation isn’t bad… on the other hand, that word “addicted” seems to cling to everything sexual in conservative circles: sex addiction, porn addiction, masturbation addiction. I guess some of use have “orgasm addiction.” Without condemning all people who have slightly less progressive values about sexuality (i.e. I’m sure my parents did their best), I found that it was easiest to learn all that once I got out of the repressive atmosphere.
Sexuality for 13 year old boys is odd enough without worrying about overbearing parents calling you addicted! And males can learn that “porn is arousing” and also learn “porn is not realistic”. Some males don’t go off and assume women are sex toys just because they watched a little pornography.
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He appears to be streaming it to his phone which costs much money, and staying up all night, which hampers his days.
They should say that if he doesn’t quit, they will take away the data plan. He should be watching that on the computer, anyway, where it does not cost money unless you enter a pay site. I suppose he could do that as well but I suspect he would have to have a credit card. On whether it is a good idea, it’s a phase I am guessing; they should take away all electronics at a certain hour.
Also, I wonder about magazines. Cheaper, and not likely to be as absorbing as video, perhaps.
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If costs were the issue, they could just give him access to the Internet and forget about the entire thing. I find it hard to believe that these people have no Internet at home.
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my fear is that he is seeing women be degraded and presented as a product for consumption.
Where’s the connection? Football players or rugby players are very much degraded as a product for consumption in their sports, yet we do not assume that people treat each other differently Monday at the office because they saw a game the night before.
I think even the stupidest 13 yr old (though not necessarily his mother) knows enough about the world not to expect his jr. high school sweetheart and a professional porn star to behave the same way, be it in the sack or outside of it.
So why would he see his sweetheart as a “product for consumption” simply because he saw a paid professional perform some ungodly act?
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In my experience it is older, not younger men or teenagers who actually imagine porn is like reality, etc., that what porn stars do is what they actually like to do in their off time, etc.
On the rest of it, the child is too old to have his mother asking leading questions about how he feels about women or giving didactic little speeches, even if it is supposed to be “open communication.” (Why is it, anyway, that kids are always expected to accept interrogation from parents, just so that “communication” can be “open”?)
If you read down in the thread, it begins to sound as though the child may have other problems; perhaps those should be addressed. Or taken more in stride, it is hard to tell what the situation really is like. I’d laconically but insistently stress, no violent speech on my property, blah blah, the same way I do not let some of my older relatives use racial slurs in my presence, and see how it went from there.
Perhaps I am too laconic. My own son is not perfect on the subject of women.
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“(Why is it, anyway, that kids are always expected to accept interrogation from parents, just so that “communication” can be “open”?”
– Good question!
“If you read down in the thread, it begins to sound as though the child may have other problems; perhaps those should be addressed. ”
– That’s the feeling I got. Which makes it even more sad that the mother is obsessing over porn instead of concentrating on those issues.
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Ewwwwwwwwweeeeewwwwww! Ditto to everything you said.
Ewwwwwwwwwweeewww!
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I think I would have lost interest in this kid, were I his mother. Not turned against him, of course, but just have developed a certain indifference toward him and his activities. I have only daughters, thank god.
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I think this is the best that could happen. Such burning parental interest at this age doesn’t make anybody happy.
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Furthermore, the mothers of adolescents can’t win. They are always in the wrong, whatever they do. My unsolicited advice: it’s best to write oneself off as a mother and get busy with other matters. Just do what you have to do: fix meals, clean the house, drive them places until they get their drivers’ licenses. And be sure you have a life of your own. And keep your sense of humor.
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At 13, the kid is more than ready to make his own meals and to clean. The driving is a huge issue and I have no idea how people deal with it without getting very angry every 15 minutes. I keep thinking about it and I don’t see a solution. I feel so sorry for the poor teenagers who live in my town. I’d just go nuts if I were them. They are locked at home, like prisoners, it’s horrible for their development.
I don’t want to think about this right now because I will get too depressed.
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@Hattie
I think that is the refrain of most parents when it comes to their teenagers, lol.
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Lots of teenagers too young to drive ride anywhere around town they wish on bicycles.
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You can’t ride out of my residential area on a bicycle. There is nothing but a highway. 😦 😦
This isn’t a town, that’s the problem. We have small clusters of buildings with completely overgrown areas between them. The clusters are connected only by highways. 😦
I’m starting to get a feeling that there are many areas like this in the country.
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The road in front of my home growing up was a U. S. highway; U. S. 11W to be precise. It is now called Tennessee 126. When I was a teenager, I rode a bicycle on the highway. It was a two lane road with high speed traffic. Unless the only road is an Interstate highway, riding a bicycle along with car trqaffic is a great way to learn the rules of the road and the reasons for them.
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“The road in front of my home growing up was a U. S. highway; U. S. 11W to be precise. It is now called Tennessee 126. When I was a teenager, I rode a bicycle on the highway. It was a two lane road with high speed traffic. Unless the only road is an Interstate highway, riding a bicycle along with car trqaffic is a great way to learn the rules of the road and the reasons for them.”
– We all know that I’m not a helicopter. I was OK with Sister doing many different things but I would never let her on a bike down this highway. Drug-addled teenage crowds don’t scare me. 🙂 But this highway does.
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Interesting that the mother isnt concerned of what her 13yr old son will think of the men in the “porn” movies. I bet she identifies as a feminist. 😉
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Good point.
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I think she expects that he will identify with them.
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Who, the porn stars or the feminists? 🙂
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The male porn stars.
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Who knows, maybe she wanted him to identify with the female ones. Priceless, you just cant make this shit up.
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“Who knows, maybe she wanted him to identify with the female ones.”
I think she is afraid of him seeing the women in porn as less than human, and thus hoping that he can identify with them.
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Out of subject, but I have this about Chick-Fil-a: http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-family-center-shooting-20120816,0,24173.story
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Superb post! 🙂
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“don’t read the comments to the linked post.” So I’ll read the comments! 😉
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Prepare to be appalled.
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I’m not sure that the blogger’s suggestion at Shakesville is so bad, though, but she should address the mother’s behavior like you did.
What do you think about this site?
http://www.scarleteen.com/
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I’m sure it’s a good website but I don’t really see it as a substitute for porn. 🙂
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No, but maybe this is interesting for someone who don’t know much about it.
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Yeah, those comments almost all suck!
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RE:
You can’t ride out of my residential area on a bicycle. There is nothing but a highway. 😦 😦
This isn’t a town, that’s the problem. We have small clusters of buildings with completely overgrown areas between them. The clusters are connected only by highways. 😦
I’m starting to get a feeling that there are many areas like this in the country.
–This is true and it is a serious problem.
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