Just to illustrate the real cause of the problem that Affirmative Consent laws are trying to address.
A mother on Dr. Phil admits that she abuses and beats her 13 – year – old daughter.
“What does she needs to do for you to stop treating her this way?” Dr. Phil asks.
“She should do what I tell her and stop saying ‘no’ to me,” the mother announces brightly.
Ten years from now, this girl will be posting online an essay about how she wanted to say no but couldn’t get herself heard.
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Sorry, I got so used to my first message after a long break does not getting published, that I started creating dummy posts…
Anyway, this is one of those many instances where I agree with you about the ideal state of the world, but disagree about the ways to deal with the current reality. Yes, of course, if all parents did not abuse their children and could accept no for an answer, we would have much less problems with consent. But legions of kids are already messed up this way. And many of them are not in a position to seek psychological help immediately even if they understand the roots of their problems. Does it mean that everyone should abstain from trying to solve the problem in other ways? Probably not optimal ways… But if for some people this informed enthusiastic consent thing works (as in – saving them from experiencing deeper trauma) – why not? Or do you think it will reduce motivation to seek real psychological help? Even if this is true – I do not feel it is an ethical position – “so she got screwed over by her parents, let her now have some non-consensual sexual experiences so she will get motivated to address her problems”… Too libertarian for my taste…
Note – I am not implying that you said that, but in my opinion that would be a logical consequence…
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“Or do you think it will reduce motivation to seek real psychological help?”
– Yes, precisely, that is the problem I see with this (aside from the issue of a great number of wrongful prosecutions, of course). People hear that the problem lies somewhere outside them – in men, in legislature, in society, in campus authorities, etc. Combined with an already weak tradition of introspection, where would these young women even find a suggestion that something is not right with them? Nobody is telling them that. I haven’t found a single space aside from my own blog where there would be any suggestions that they should seek psychological help.
“Even if this is true – I do not feel it is an ethical position – “so she got screwed over by her parents, let her now have some non-consensual sexual experiences so she will get motivated to address her problems””
– If I thought for a second that these laws could spare anybody a second of unpleasant experience, I wouldn’t mind them. I don’t really mind them all that much as it is, to be honest. I’m not about to go militate against them or anything. But I do think it is important that at least somebody should be talking about what the roots of the problem are.
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My parents said that if I wanted the pain in my life to stop I had to learn to “trust” — but this was AFTER they had already undermined me several times and abused me severely when I had walked into some trouble and requested their help. Trust was what I had already begun to unlearn — to save my life.
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I have also realized that whenever somebody asks me to trust them, they are about yo do something shitty.
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And I should add that therapists absolutely could not help me at all, not only because I was unable to afford them, but because when I could, they did not understand the African situation or the migratory situation or anything like that, and they just assumed I knew a whole lot more about a whole lot of things than I did. My African situation had been more like 18th Century Europe than anything I had encountered in the contemporary West.
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Thirty years from now, when Dear Ol’ Ma is a wizened old bat nobody can manage, the daughter will ask for help with dealing with her …
If Dear Ol’ Ma is lucky, she’ll get checked into a hospice where they can deal with her bollocks and generally ugly demeanour as professionals.
If she’s unlucky, she’ll meet a not-too-understanding care planner who pushes her onto something like the Liverpool Life Care Plan, and that’ll pretty much be the end of her.
Her daughter won’t genuinely give a crap either way by then, and she’ll welcome the eventual relief.
If you’re thinking this is horrible, realise this choice is made every day, possibly by someone you know …
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Actually, yes, I have an older friend who is dealing with an abusive mother who is now elderly and has the perfect excuse to be even more abusive than ever. Sp yes, you are right.
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