Translation Doubts

~ Clarissa

So, fellow language lovers, what would you call this in English:

They have filling, see:

I never make them because I don’t do flour but they are very popular in our cuisine.

It feels weird to call them pies. “Kolia ran to the window holding a pie in his hand” gives me an image of a large thing on a baking sheet. Or am I wrong and “pie” is fine for “пиріжок”?

I have half a mind to go with “pirozhki” because that’s what it is but the plural is throwing me off.

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Published by Clarissa

35 thoughts on “Translation Doubts”

  1. “what would you call this in English”

    This is where pluricentrism in English bites translatores in the ass…..

    I think for British people (and those heavily influenced by British norms) you could just about get away with ‘pie’ (they do make meat pies that can be held in one hand, sort of like large empenadas) but not Americans for whom ‘pie’ is a whole other critter.

    If it’s stage directions for an American audience I might go with ‘stuffed roll’ or just ‘roll’ if the filling isn’t important.

    Alternately I might go with ‘pirozhki’ as a singular with the plural ‘pirozhkies’, which would parallel the English words ‘pierogies’ (singular ‘pierogi’).

    That probably sounds dreadful to you but….. the process is languages borrowing a plural form, treating it as singular (and then adding a new plural ending in the borrowing language is well known). In Polish ‘hippy’ was borrowed as ‘hippis’ with the plural ‘hippisi’ (other examples include Eskimos and Beatles (plural Beatelsie).

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  3. stuffed dumpling if you want it to convey no specific ethnicity or nationality

    perogi if you want to convey that the person is Polish or maybe generically Eastern European

    another specific name if you want to convey some other place of origin

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      1. Admittedly there’s a little bit of crossover between a “bun” and a “roll” generally. But if we do an image search for “pizza roll” or “lobster roll” (two of the most well-known American stuffed rolls), it is not a bun-like, sealed items.

        Go team ‘bun’ 🙂

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        1. I like bun. Is a bun something a 12-year-old child of an aristocrat would eat? Does it have class overtones?

          Thank you, everybody, for helping. Together, we will bring this great play to the public.

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  5. In Hebrew wikipedia I found  ‘pirozhki’ (written in Hebrew) with explanation.

    פירושקי 

    If you write “pirozhki”, you can add an explanation below for American readers.

    Pierogi are defined by wiki as традиционное блюдо польской кухни, полный аналог украинских вареников. Nobody takes an oil-dripping varenik and starts running around with it.

    Dumpling seem closest in wiki, but still sounds weird to me.

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    1. Honestly, I’ve heard of pierogi before. It’s a somewhat known word in English. Though admittedly it’s just something I have a faint idea of than a solid sense of what it is.

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        1. “You can’t hold them in your hand.”

          Well you can…. but it’s not something a non-lunatic would do…..

          Bun definitely works, I think. For ‘roll’ I was thinking of the appearance which reminds me a lot of dinner rolls.

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  6. Until I saw the filling I thought it was a sticky bun!

    We call those meat pies, just like the Jamaican version. I have also seen them called hand pies. Not sure how common either of those is… the whole concept always sounded more British than American to me.

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    1. “meat pies, just like the Jamaican version”

      But Jamaican meat pies are have a flaky crumbly crust.

      One of my all time favorite foods was from a Jamaican place with soft and chewy meat pies (they called them loaves and the meat and cheese loaf was to die for).

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  7. I’m not a translator and have no particular facility with words, but I want one of those snacks!

    How important is the food, as opposed to the action and situation?

    I’m thinking between:
    “Kolia ran to the window holding his hot stuffed roll” [I think the hot makes a big difference here]

    “Kolia ran to the window holding his mid-morning snack”

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  8. +1 for stuffed bun or savory bun. “Hand pie” conveys to me something sweet, and “pie” generally suggests pastry crust. The snack in the picture looks more like something made with a bread dough crust.

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  10. “I have half a mind to go with “pirozhki” because that’s what it is but the plural is throwing me off.”

    Go with your half a mind and use pirozhki. If you must then include [bread bud baked with meat inside] and the plural would be pirozhkis.

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  12. Sausage bun, pork bun, sausage roll, chicken bun or roll. Buns and rolls by themselves are just unstuffed bread.

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  16. Regarding translations, do you love Evgeny Schwartz?

    It’s truly a pity that English-speakers can read only one of his plays “The Dragon”, when “The Shadow” or “The Snow Queen” are not worse imo.

    Full text of “The Dragon” translation is free online. If any readers are interested here is a short explanation:

    In 1944, Schwartz completed the satirical play The Dragon, which was seen as subversive in the political climate of post-war Russia. The play tells the story of the knight Lancelot, who sets out to slay the dragon. However, in his quest, he stumbles on a community governed by a bureaucratic hierarchy using the dragon to cover their own use of power.

    This play, the most “mature” of Schwartz’s plays, is a political satire aimed at totalitarianism in all forms. The plot is based on the attempt of the hero, Lancelot, to liberate people in a land suffering under Dragon’s brutal rule. But his efforts meet with resistance, since most of the people have gotten used to the Dragon and considered his methods, though harsh, the only possible way; their souls become, in a way, crippled with this inability and unwillingness to resist. Says the Dragon in the play: “You see, the human soul is very resilient. Cut the body in half — and the man croaks. But tear the soul apart — and it only becomes more pliable, that’s all. No, really, you couldn’t pick a finer assortment of souls anywhere. Only in my town. Souls with no hands. Souls with no legs. Mute souls, deaf souls, chained souls, snitch souls, damned souls.”

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  17. In Western Canada, where I live, piroshki would be well understood and easily distinguishable from perogi (spelled 1/2 a dozen ways) that are almost a dietary staple here

    Raymond R

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